Sunday, November 18, 2007

Told You So ...

I really hate to say I told you so. Honest, I do.
But sometimes you just have to. Because its true. And now I have proof.

I know its true because Blackfive said so.

Supporting the troops who really do keep bad guys from hurting your worthless behinds and pay blood price so you can freely show your ignorance and shortcomings to the world (and basic lack of commitment to free speech) does NOT equal supporting the war. They are, in fact, two separate things and only a mind operating in non-Euclidean space rather than reality could possibly find an intersection between the two. Since it is obvious that you failed basic logic (and probably most science courses as well I bet), they are exclusive of one another.
Okay, sure, they were talking about that incredibly stupid power play involved in the Election Committee's decision to order the Boy Scouts to remove their care boxes soliciting donations to support the troops. Because, you know. It was a political message. During an election. Can't have that.

Still, its not like you're going to argue with Balckfive, right?

And before anybody crawls in or swoops down and goes *there*, you can find my own personal viewpoint here.


Punkys Dilemma said...

Hey there, now I don't want you to think that I'm coming into your home and not sitting down... ;) I'm quite comfortable here, doncha know. Just soaking it all in right now. And will have a seat just as soon as I get a plate of munchies.... :)
A'lll be back....

MMC said...

I would say... Looks like you just root around like you own the place. I got an eye on you young lady. Get your munchies and have a seat but you best be on your best behaviour.

Anonymous said...

I definitely support the troops, there is no way I could feel otherwise but, unfortunately -some may think- I am one of those who support the troops and hate the war. And there is no need here to say what a very bad guy Saddam was, or how terrible we (I) consider it to be a woman in this part of world. because I think we all agree here.
I was absolutely for going into Afghanistan and getting Bin Laden, believe me. The world was FOR -at the least the world I move round in- mobilization and taking the area but ... the bugger couldn't be found,so .... yep, what I didn't like was the 'well then, let's go to Iran'. Bin Laden is still not caught. Saddam is no more which I personally am very happy about and now ... now I guess it's not a question of just packing up and leaving, now they probably have to stay until there is some sort of normalcy?, democracy? ... Democracy, funny how so many people have their own definition of democracy.
Eileen, Argentina

doorkeeper said...

How can anyone make a judgement about the "war" if there is no good (correct) information coming out about it?

doorkeeper said...

Gotta figure out how to say this:

There's a big difference between honestly believing we should stop the war asap, bring the boys home, and working toward that end....

and doing nothing more than putting on inflammatory bumper stickers and even standing around with inflammatory signs--getting attention for yourself.

Then there's war- and soldier-bashing.....that cannot be done and still "support the troops" although some left-wing nutjobs believe it to be so.....they have BDS so bad, they believe that.

MMC said...


Punkys Dilemma said...

Yes, I do tend to trapse around your 'home' looking in all your rooms without your consent, don't I? Ahhhh but it is a lovely home. :)
I think dk said it in a nutshell. We aren't getting enough of the correct information.
Honestly, who am I to say. I know nothing about being on the frontline. I just believe that our soldiers are in a war and their goal is to accomplish the mission.
I think its extremely important that we support not only them but what they're doing. How do we not?

Anonymous said...

doorkeeper: Interesting- and how does one define correct information?
I don't want this to be an issue again. I do not like confrontation of any kind. I do understand defending the homeland. I don't think any country would like to have an alien country impose their ideas, customs, mores or whatever on their own. I know you wouldn't . I know I wouldn't.
Heck, there are even different opinions as to what democracy means and entails. Don't misunderstand me I am very very but very very pro democracy -
BTW I am not a left wing nutjob - even if I don't agree with some of what the right wing postulates. In my country I would definitely be defined as right wing ...strange isn't it?

MMC said...

eb, all doorkeeper commented on was the fact that it would be difficult to make a judgment on the war without correct information on it. Seems like an innoculous enough statement to me...

And I don't think we were discussing the rightness or wrongness of the war itself. The orignal post was on whether it was possible to support the troops without supporting the war. Many, many people seem to think that's a logical (or some of other kind of) impossibility. I, for one, disagree.

So ... I think its cool.

doorkeeper said...

Ah, finally the power is back on and I can pick up where I left off. Thanks for being patient, eb and everyone. (third power outage today)

I know personally, a number of troops who have served in Iraq, some in what were the worst areas of the country (places where you can walk without body armor today)

So I think I can speak to the incredible dichotomy between what our soldiers are saying about what's happening in Iraq, and what we're hearing from the media and politicians. The two groups MUST be speaking of two different wars--it's just not possible for both to be telling the truth about the same conflict.

So someone is lying, or misinformed, or twisting the truth, or whatever you want to say. I've seen the photos, I've talked to the boys. I know they have some cynicism (I think that's part of the uniform!) but they're the ones who have "been there, done that." And I have to believe them over some two bit newspaper reporter who got a personal, protected tour around a REMF unit with officers whose whole job is to do that--protect the precious media guys and make sure they're always safe--and not comment on what they say. (BTW, a REMF is someone who stays carefully in the rear, away from any action, usually office/intel weenies who use more paper than ammo.)
(And don't ask what the letters stand for, 'cause Mama told me not to say that!)

I don't believe that we are getting correct information in any country, from the media, but I'd bet my "proud wife of a veteran" hat that American is one of the worst.

And always remember, it's not part of a soldier's job to comment publicly on their mission, before, during or after.....they're trained to believe it's unnecessary and possibly disloyal; since they have people whose job it IS to do that.

And it frees them to do their mission.

that's most of it on the "correct information" area...questions?

doorkeeper said...

I don't want confrontation, and I certainly understand the futility of arguing a point when both sides have their minds firmly made up.

But can I ask, eb, what do you mean by your statement:

"I don't think any country would like to have an alien country impose their ideas, customs, mores or whatever on their own. I know you wouldn't . I know I wouldn't."

I thought we were talking about Iraq--and I have not heard of that happening in any way, there. Can you give specifics?

thanks, d